Advice needed in a critical situation

sdiva20 · Sep 23, 2014

We are all speculating that the husband is the villain (and most likely could be) but we don't know for sure. We are also speculating that he want to get out of paying alimony etc.

I agree, both should have settled their very obviously irreconcilable difference in a more mature manner at least for their kids sake. As is obvious, both have proved to be immature and irresponsible.

Akanksha1982 said: ↑

Agreed both have been immature and should have resolved their incompatibility before getting two innocent lives in this world. At least now for the sake of their children, they should have reconciled. There are many ways of doing so like filing a divorce, going for counselling, involving elders in either side of the family etc rather than subjecting wife to humiliation and jail for 5 to 15 years. This is his wife and the mother of his kids. Its not an intruder or a stranger. If he wants to avoid alimony, he could have settled that with the wife. This is like a long time built vengeance that he had and got an opportunity to execute on his vengeance.

I understand that the she shouldn't have reacted in such a way and should have controlled herself unless she was getting overpowered or was acting in self defense. However, spending 5 to 15 years in prison and kids losing their mother doesn't seem right to me. I wouldn't even curse my worst enemy like that leave alone someone that's related to me.
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1Sandhya · Sep 23, 2014

yellowmango said: ↑

From the original post.

While I do sympathize with the friend...probably doesn't deserve to go to jail...I don't understand the tide against the husband.

They had a volatile relationship. From the op it does not look like she was in an one sided abusive relationship.Mutually hurting each other is mutually abusive.The worst kind of situation for children to be in.

It also doesn't look like this was the only incidence of violence between them.Her silence on the issue also points towards her not being in an abusive relationship.

While we do see more cases of men being the abuser...there are enough cases of women being mentally and physically abusive.In most such cases...men are too embarrassed to even accept in public that they are physically abused by their wives till it is too much and becomes life threatening. Attacking with a knife definitely falls under the same .

According to the original post....he went to office the next morning and came back with the cops...not after a week.

It seems quite logical...he is a man with two small kids. He called his mother...met with some lawyers and then called the cops.Exactly what we would advise a woman to do...get away,consult a lawyer and involve the police.

He obviously wants an end to this marriage .He is probably looking for the more fool proof ,fastest way of going about it.As for wanting custody of children,it is also quite logical....the parent who has more self control and less violent ways should want the child if he is responsible.As for alimony...I wouldn't want to pay a fat alimony to a person who attacks me with a knife.

What strikes me as shocking is a apathy of her own family. When your child is looking at a possible jail sentence....you expect more than just financial support from the parents.

I also find is surprising that an engineer with two children is behaving in such a naive manner.

As for the children being denied access to a mother......We have all seen enough cases of mothers harming their own children .....jumping into well after throwing the children first,poisoning them and then killing self. Extreme cases.....but they do happen. A person who can pick up a knife...should have to go through some psychiatric evaluation before being trusted with children.
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So YM, according to you she deserves all this because she picked up a knife? butter knife or not is immaterial to you, right? knife is knife, right? Okay.

So what do you say she could have done instead? Both were in the middle of a heated argument, he had her pushed up against a wall, strongly enough that there are marks on her arms per op's account...That was the situation. As it happened the butter knife was within reach and she grabbed it and used it to make him let go, again per op. You disapprove of that, very strongly I might add. So do tell what else she could have done to make him let her go when she was in that situation?

I am not supporting her action and I am not condemning her action. I feel this whole incident was like an accident, regrettable, yes, avoidable, maybe but it happened, thats it. But you obviously do not so I would like to know what other options you would feel you would have had in that situation.

Booni · Sep 23, 2014

The stingy husband took the credit card and gave only debit card in which hardly was any money. I only collected her wallet from him after she was out on bail.
In that debit card her dad has put some money now. The lawyer is aware of all these. They suggested legal separation /divorce route which is in process now. Again it's an expensive affair from her side. After the process the husband has to pay but before that we need to pay retainment fee.
It runs like $3500/-which is very hard to send from India right? .
We stopped talking about the past. The kids didn't witness anything. It all happened when they were asleep. And the husband and wife always argued but only twice physicals took place first time knife second time nail scratch and slight choking. Both the physical was done by wife. Husband pushed and scratched nails. So with this two incidents itself he got fear of life and called cops and still in fear hence the restraining order - according to him.
We stopped talking about the past.

peartree · Sep 23, 2014

Booni

Even with or without this whole mess, you friend needs some very serious counseling for anger management!

What is this knife-wielding and nail scratching and all that? Whether perpetrated by the woman or the man.... it is dangerous! I feel that the husband is justified in calling the cops over her, because she does seem to lose it very easily, and takes a very aggressive stance.

In any case, are there any woman shelters or something like that in Houston where she can stay to sort all this mess out? I just found this when I googled - http://www.hawc.org/.

Please see if you can hook her up with something like that, so that you're not having to be so directly involved in this mess. I am sure it's a drain on you guys emotionally and financially to have to deal with this. My heart does go out to her parents in India, who are probably helpless knowing that their daughter is in a situation like this, but as Rihanna said, there's only so much you can and should do.

Rihana · Sep 23, 2014

Akanksha, Hopefully the two will reconcile, and put this behind them, and move on. But, when matters reach the level of divorce, it is each for self.

Akanksha1982 said: ↑

Agreed both have been immature and should have resolved their incompatibility before getting two innocent lives in this world. At least now for the sake of their children, they should have reconciled. There are many ways of doing so like filing a divorce, going for counselling, involving elders in either side of the family etc rather than subjecting wife to humiliation and jail for 5 to 15 years. This is his wife and the mother of his kids. Its not an intruder or a stranger. If he wants to avoid alimony, he could have settled that with the wife.
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Each of those options - filing for divorce, counselling, involving elders, has its pros and cons. Family court judges are generally pro-woman. Her dependent status would probably get her sympathy. Once spouse gets a whiff of divorce plans, he or she can create havoc in the bank accounts. Element of surprise is often useful. Why blame the man so wholesomely? Once he is attacked by a knife, she might as well be a stranger or intruder. That she is the mother of his children is such a filmi argument to bring up.

In fact, it is even harder when there are kids involved. The man has to live with the decision of putting his kids through a divorce. I don't think this thing is easy for him either. If he has taken steps that will minimize how much he has to pay in alimony, is it so wrong? How is he supposed to work out the alimony part with his wife? Why would she agree to less than she can get?

I still hope they are able to reconcile, and move on to lead at least a basic version of happy lives, but, let's not blame the man so much.

This is like a long time built vengeance that he had and got an opportunity to execute on his vengeance.
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Possible. We do not know what all happened in their lives other than this incident.

I understand that the she shouldn't have reacted in such a way and should have controlled herself unless she was getting overpowered or was acting in self defense. However, spending 5 to 15 years in prison and kids losing their mother doesn't seem right to me. I wouldn't even curse my worst enemy like that leave alone someone that's related to me.
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Easy to say. When it comes to divorce, things are usually very ugly. Maybe there was no other way for the man to get sole custody of the children? Curse and enemy and all that are theory and instinctive reactions from us readers. Actually going through that is different.

Ragini25 · Sep 23, 2014

Wonder what IL-ites would say if the genders were reversed?
i am sure atleast a few would say next time he tries it - call the cops etc etc.
here gender is reversed though...
suffice it to say - in either gender - dont call the cops unless its truly critical. For normal hubby wife fights (even though mild physical) - deal with it among urselves in other ways, maybe separation in certain cases.
use law and order only for real serious cases.

Gauri03 · Sep 23, 2014

OP is a good and kind friend. She is going above and beyond her duties as a friend to help the woman in question. But when we care about someone, we are predisposed to certain cognitive biases in favor of those individuals. OP's version of the events are based on her friend's account, and are naturally skewed in favor of the wife. As they say, there are three versions of any event, his, hers, and the truth. We need to remember that the version we are hearing here is not entirely representative of the events as they took place.

Some of the comments on this thread remind me of this PSA - #ViolenceIsViolencen

Akanksha1982 · Sep 23, 2014

Rihana said: ↑

Easy to say. When it comes to divorce, things are usually very ugly. Maybe there was no other way for the man to get sole custody of the children? Curse and enemy and all that are theory and instinctive reactions from us readers. Actually going through that is different.
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Rihana, Is the anger, ego or whatever so worth it that one would put his spouse in jail, put her literally on streets with no where to go, put her into a situation with no money and a big hole of lawyers fees? Can some humanity or commonsense prevail? OP, unknown is doing so much for her friend just for humanity purpose while he is doing so much harm to his own wife and he knows he is the only person who can stop this misery. With all the money/gold he may have received from his wife, at least he can send her back and reunite her with her parents.

ZenSojourner · Sep 23, 2014

1Sandhya said: ↑

Bringing his mom immediately to take care of the kids, who does that?
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Heck, the visa delays ALONE show this is not spur-of-the-moment. I guess I'm assuming that the parents live in India ... nevertheless. The whole thing smacks of precision planning and manipulation.

And get serious. A BUTTER KNIFE? That is not a deadly weapon.

He orchestrated the whole thing so he can get off scot free, keep the kids, and not pay alimony. How much do you want to bet that there's already a 2nd marriage all lined up for him? More dowry for him.

She needs NOT to apologize. She needs to assume this marriage is over, and make it so even if he loses the court case and tries to back down. She needs to take her kids and make sure he pays child support and alimony. SHE NEEDS TO MOVE TO PROTECT HERSELF AND HER KIDS, because a smarmy jerk like that is going to be every bit as bad as a parent as he was a husband.

1Sandhya · Sep 23, 2014

Booni said: ↑

The stingy husband took the credit card and gave only debit card in which hardly was any money. I only collected her wallet from him after she was out on bail.
In that debit card her dad has put some money now. The lawyer is aware of all these. They suggested legal separation /divorce route which is in process now. Again it's an expensive affair from her side. After the process the husband has to pay but before that we need to pay retainment fee.
It runs like $3500/-which is very hard to send from India right? .
We stopped talking about the past. The kids didn't witness anything. It all happened when they were asleep. And the husband and wife always argued but only twice physicals took place first time knife second time nail scratch and slight choking. Both the physical was done by wife. Husband pushed and scratched nails. So with this two incidents itself he got fear of life and called cops and still in fear hence the restraining order - according to him.
We stopped talking about the past.
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op, I dont understand. So she does not have a joint bank account with him? No checks or cc from the joint account etc? when did he close their joint account and opened /transferred into a personal acct --then that also shows premeditation. And what was he doing with her purse/wallet that you had to take from him? How come her purse was not with her or in the police station with the officers? What a mess!

Again I dont know too much about all this but cant she get the states' help? Claim she is indigent and get a public defender? What s her visa status? Is she on GC or a citizen?