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Will The Central Government Ever Stop Pushing Hindi On Tamil Nadu ?

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Minion, Oct 18, 2020.

  1. Minion

    Minion Gold IL'ite

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    @Laks09

    Of course. It’s annoying when North Indians claim Hindi as the National
    Language that everyone should know. But when a group of people are conversing and someone approaches you inHindi, calling that an insult to South Indiansness is also a bit much. And it happens quite a lot.

    Bit annoying? That’s a problem for me you just assume that if you are Indian then you have to know Hindi, what’s next call a person from Sikkim Chinese because they all have Chinese features? Where does this end?
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  2. sokanasanah

    sokanasanah IL Hall of Fame

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    Until the IT revolution, the net migration in India was from the south to the then more economically successful 'north', to cities like Bombay and Delhi. There still are lively south Indian communities in these cities with temples, cultural institutions, 'sabhas' and whatnot. There has also been resistance - the Shiv Sena in Bombay** being a prominent example. Noticeable, voluntary migration from the north to the south is relatively recent, to the IT hubs of Bangalore, Hyderabad, and Chennai. While the first-gen migrants may not know Tamizh, the kids learn to speak it well because of their friends and schoolmates and the milieu they grow up in. Reading and writing, of course, depends on the school. It has always been possible to grow up in Chennai speaking Tamizh, but without reliable read/write capability. Tamizh in schools was not compulsory, I think. Not sure about the situation now. I know quite a few kids from north Indian families settled in Chennai who speak Tamizh, while also enthusiastically sailing through their bharatanatyam arangetram!

    Note: I am simply exploring socioeconomic and sociocultural fallout from linguistic differences and its links to internal migration in India. Not implying that anyone said anything directly about this.

    **Quote from the page linked above: "The Shiv Sena was founded in 1966, three years after Bal Thackeray – a cartoonist and editor of satirical Marathi weekly magazine Marmik – began publishing lists of all the non-Maharashtrians heading major companies in Mumbai. He named this weekly column “Read and Rise”, in a bid to stir popular sentiment against people from “outside” depriving Marathi speakers of jobs and opportunities.

    The first target of this “sons of the soil” rhetoric were south Indians, or “Madrasis”**, as Thackeray pejoratively called them. On October 30, 1966, Thackeray gave a fiery speech at his first Dussera rally in Shivaji Park (now an annual tradition), after which incensed Sena workers pelted stones at Udupi restaurants on their way out. Such attacks were to become part of the Sena's standard repertoire."

    **Hence my exhortation in an earlier post to avoid the term 'Madrasi" - it has odious roots. I do believe that there is an effort to foist Hindi on the south. However, as Indians we also need to be careful about the ways in which we assert cultural and linguistic identity. Violence always lurks around the corner.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  3. Minion

    Minion Gold IL'ite

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    Another example of how anyone can move to TN and live peacefully, most of the pawnshop in TN are owned by Rajasthani, TN has never shown hostility like bal thackeray or periodic violence that erupts against Tamils in Karnataka

    1991 anti-Tamil violence in Karnataka - Wikipedia

    Tamil Jain - Wikipedia
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  4. stayblessed

    stayblessed Gold IL'ite

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    :roflmao:
    Its because English is an acquired language for all states within India whereas hindi is the language of a particular state within India which means English is new to everyone in India and learning it is difficult or easy in the same level for every indian of course language learning capacity is different from person to person. But am talking about the basics of a language and general mental attitude and basic expectation of everyone to be treated equally. I can understand your husbands abhorrence for hindi. Forcing needn't be from outside or from the government. Even parents consistently telling learning hindi is important to survive outside india and the rigorous tuitions a person goes through to learn hindi in a non hindi state can cause this aversion. I have seen kids taking tuitions and clearing hindi prachar sabha exams like prathmik etc. It means you allocate time for a language outside your studies and your own language. In thamizhnadu hindi was not compulsory even as a third language in state schools or cbse schools until nep came. For that matter even thamizh wasn't compulsory. A child can either take thamizh as the second language or hindi or sanskrit or French. There were no third language concepts.Of course like other South Indian states the thmizhnadu govt which so much boasts of the thmizh pride should have made the local language compulsory but their intention was only vote bank and not really the love of thamizh. With NEP the one good thing is the regional language has been made compulsory. CG has to be lauded for that. Coming back to our topic for hindi you always have to take the extra effort. So may be thats why your husband and some thamizhians hate hindi and introspect why a person from non hindi state has to take the extra effort to learn a language. The thing is thamizh or hindi or any language can be learnt in speaking level when we hear many people around us speak instead of having to learn to read and write. It shouldn't be the govts decision which extra language a person wants to learn and whether or not he wants to learn and the choice be left to the people. I can totally understand your husbands hatred for hindi and many thamizhians have this hatred. I can now see similar kind of protests from people of karnataka too as to why hindi is being celebrated by the cg and continuously being pushed to other states. This type of commotion is no good in the long run. There are two ways of looking at it. Whats in learning an additional language and why should we learn an additional language and whether the other Indian states take the effort to learn a South Indian language. Even now the north indian states are learning only hindi and with nep too they are additionally learning only sanskrit and not a South Indian language. This type of discrimination has caused agitation in peoples minds. The argument that hindi is being pushed to unify the country will totally work in the opposite. I personally feel the cg should concentrate on much important problems that India is facing instead of forcing hindi.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
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  5. stayblessed

    stayblessed Gold IL'ite

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    I agree the tone is condescending. Had his way of putting been appropriate many people here would have been able to see the valid points he has posted. Thats the problem I see here now. Many people have valid things to say but if they can do it in a non patronising way others can actually benefit and it would be easy to see things from their perspective. After all we come here to learn new things and offer what we know to people. If people don't want to hear opposing views then why start a thread in the first place. Disagreeing with someone can be done politely too
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
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  6. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Very Unfair. Sanskrit is a dying language and no amount of money poured over it can revive it. It's completely gone. I wish this was done for English a language that Indians will find better use for.

    Which politician actually works for the greater good of the people? He's working for his vote bank. The lesser exposed his people, the better it is for him. I think the people of TN are making better sense than the politicians.

    Which I completely agree with.

    Did not disagree with this one bit. My question was relevance. UPites being poor and getting a Lion's share of CG's allocations should not be a reason a sign board in Chennai cannot have Hindi in addition to two other languages.
    I think the people of TN should focus on Tamil being taught in schools rather than eliminate all other competitors.

    I also think it's a good thing to give some grace to the struggling low wage earners. It is ok to give the low income migrant workers some leeway. They won't take over Chennai. The reverse is true. They will learn to cohabit and learn to integrate. That's how migrations typically work. Can locals consider it a minor hiccup to respond in Hindi at a Toll Plaza? As an immigrant you know what it does to leave your land behind and assimilate elsewhere. I would say think about it in those work conditions. It can't be easy.Even so usually, the migrants learn the language and once they learn they do help in sustaining it. Historically people have come to SI states and learned the langauge. That's the uniqueness of all the SI states.



    Why is it not a problem if they assume you are Tamil and start a convo in Tamil? Why is that such an elating occurrence? Even that happens, very regularly now a days since we have a huge influx of Tamil speaking people around us. I don't see it as a huge problem and that's where I differ. I've always spoken one language at home and three others outside of the house. If someone talks to me in any of the languages I know, I respond.
     
  7. Minion

    Minion Gold IL'ite

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    Why is it not a problem if they assume you are Tamil and start a convo in Tamil? Why is that such an elating occurrence? Even that happens, very regularly now a days since we have a huge influx of Tamil speaking people around us. I don't see it as a huge problem and that's where I differ. I've always spoken one language at home and three others outside of the house. If someone talks to mein any of the languages I know, I respond.

    When I see a new Indian I always start a conversation with Hello in English and just the basic awareness and respect that India is a diverse country that has multiple language goes a long way, I don’t expect them to start a conversation in Tamil.

    Very Unfair. Sanskrit is a dying language and no amount of money poured over it can revive it. It's completely gone. I wish this was done for English a language that Indians will find better use for.

    This is why I am saying that the center is constantly engaged in micro aggressions against the non-Hindi speaking states.

    Did not disagree with this one bit. My question was relevance. UPites being poor and getting a Lion's share of CG's allocations should not be a reason a sign board in Chennai cannot have Hindi in addition to two other languages.

    Why not think of it this way the states that provide resources will also be allowed to teach their language in the states that receive the help?
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  8. netflx

    netflx Silver IL'ite

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    Sorry to digress, not relevant to this thread but didn't realize Minion is a male. (Again irrelevant to this topic, a quick digression observation (for me) voiced-out aloud thats all, sorry).
     
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  9. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    So true. I can see what an uphill battle this is going to be. Even the most well meaning politician is still a politician.

    I don't know about this. I only read briefly but why make the medium of instruction in Govt schools the local language. I understand mandating the local language but making it the medium of instruction is counter productive. I wish the medium was made English pan India. The language trifecta is a good idea, but the medium being the local language in elementary, blah.

    Yes, this is true.
    Sanskrit or Urdu/punjabi etc. I can understand Punjabi/Urdu etc but Sanskrit? Its a dying language. I agree with you, a SI language as third language in the Ganga Belt isn't a bad idea at all. Especially when the mother tongue is already Hindi.
     
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  10. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Clicking on his profile will show you the gender below the username.
     

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