Indus Valley to Incredible India

My dear Anna it was very interesting to read your new write up. Your grand daughter is very intelligent after all she is your granddaughter na. I am sure she must be taking you as her Role Model. In the modern world good things are happening and also bad. Today's youngsters are more knowledgable than us thanks to modern technology. Like Shyamala has mentioned we hope that our grand daughters will be in a better world. As always I dont know what else to write but cant be without giving fb to your thread. So have taken the help of Google hope the quotes are apt for the thread.

One... gets an impression that civilization is something which was imposed on a resisting majority by a minority which understood how to obtain possession of the means to power and coercion. It is, of course, natural to assume that these difficulties are not inherent in the nature of civilization itself but are determined by the imperfections of the cultural forms which have so far been developed. ~Sigmund Freud, The Future of an Illusion

Let us make future generations remember us as proud ancestors just as, today, we remember our forefathers.

Roh Moo-hyun

 

Dear Cheeniya sir,

I want to say what an incredible piece of writing it is but I will refrain from saying so just beacuse the dictionary explains Incredible "as so extraordinary as to seem impossible". With Cheeniya sir, is it impossible? Thank you for bringing such a lovely piece to us. The subject you have touched upon is something I have been mulling over for quite a few days now and I would never do justice like the way you did. Instead I went about thinking how to react and protect and take care of my inner self using yoga sutras :-(

Your grand daughter has stumped you and that brings a smile to my face but then I also know that smile is there on your face and may be a tad bit of swell in your chest with pride! You should feel proud sir, not just beacuse it is your GD but if her thinking is any indication of what the future generations are thinking about, there is a ray of hope. The profundity in her thinking if it were there in every single human being even for a second a day, we have hope. We can indeed look forward to a better world.

Sigh! "Incredible" does not sound bad at all given the way the country is shaping up sir. Indeed! I looked up the the definition for the word civilized and wiki assures it still is this in reals sense of the word "in a classical context, people were called "civilized" to set them apart from barbarians, savages, and primitive culture while in a modern-day context, "civilized people" have been contrasted with indigenous people or tribal societies." and we have redifined it further in the modern sense - "Use of the word "civilized" may be controversial because it could imply superiority or inferiority." Perhaps we are trying not to be either superior or inferior with what we are doing with our selves and our society!

One of my pet peeves every time I visit and that leads to a lot of criticism and arguments is my cry that we live far more in the past glory not working on our present enough to answer questions of our children and grand children sir! We have such a strong foundation from the past, we could do wonders if we choose to! But then, I am a NRI, a Not Required Indian as told by a good friend who anyways works on and from her memories of her growing up days ! As natural as it is for civilazations to rise, grow and decay why should we not make an effort to be in the growth part as long as we can at least as far as human values are concerned?

Finally and I promose, that little piece you have shared from Yeats brought tears to my eyes. Not fair sir, not at all. Kamalji makes me laugh like a crazy woman in the morning and then you make me cry. What is happening sir? But as difficult as it is to give a name to our present state of affairs, you will agree if I say we are creatures of hope and hope that our children will make that difference and so we have to continue nurturing the good and hope as much as we can! So, thank you for sharing the information on "The story of Mankind"!

And sir if we do look around really well, all is not lost! There are some wonderful stories happening and people are making differences and for the better in their way. I sure hope that you have assured your GD that she certainly belongs to that generation who can make a change by virtue of which they will be able to give a name to the civilization, thus helping us all, as well!

 

Dear Sri,

Very valid doubt from your granddaughter. What do our times would be called after a few hundred years???

Yes, evolution and civilisation are different. Civilisation has a span of some years only. Historians many times would not present a correct picture....they would highlight the things they want to.

I agree, moral values are on the decline at a steep rate and science and technology have advanced at a very fast pace. It is incredible! May be they both are indirectly proportional!!! Future Historians would project an image that they want to. In the fast pace of life I would doubt very much in future people would analyse as in our times....they would if it profits them materialistically. Otherwise they would be just stacked in labraries.

I am an optimist. Everything is not lost. World is made up of some good people, good scenario also. Scales might be tilted. Already we hear feeble sounds of negativity towards modern technology. I go to Ramakrishna Math, Hyderabad. I see a lot of well disciplined youngsters there in School of Languages and Human Excellency, software engineers getting down from their company buses in the evening along with their computor bags to attend a lecture or Bhajan session or a Yoga class behaving very well gives hope that all is not lost. Still it would be incredible India but not completely in negative sense. Positivity also is there. So, let us hope when children like your granddaughter grow up they would be living in a better world...incredible!

Syamala

 

Cheeniya sir
Your Grand daughter has posed a very thought provoking question.. "what will our present modern age in India be called as 100s of years later?"...
on one hand all the poverty.. corruption.. deceit .. frauds.. scams.. and the other hand.. we are a rising developing world power.. a threat to reckon with.. our think tank is increasing.. and our engineers are sort after..
so lets hope and pray that this age where we live in India will be remembered as "incredible rising and shining" after all even in Ramrajya there were petty thieves and murderers...good and evil have to co-exist .. its just how much we can control the evil in us and groom the good that matters.. after all every drop makes an ocean and every citizen makes a nation.. what say???
Kerman

 

Dear Cheeniya Sir,

What a phenomenal question that your granddaughter asked you. Will our period be known as civilization and if so what will be the name of that civilization? Fortunately or unfortunately, the civilizations were developed in isolation in the earlier years because of two reasons a) there were no frequent travel and communication between various civilizations for each one to know from other civilizations and b) the members of the civilization were very proud of their accomplishments and respected their civilization. Now the world has become too flat as indicated by Thomas Friedman. The developments in information & communication technologies apart from easy transportation of people, processes, services and products made everyone's life a mixture of several civilizations.

Coming back to the Indus Civilization, like other civilizations, seeking knowledge to improve the way to conduct life has been the underlying core value. The fabric of Indus civilization seeking knowledge continue to remain intact and your granddaughter's question is proof enough for that. Traditionally, even Indus civilization was developed by the knowledge they gained from ancient scriptures and domination in mathematics came from the origin of Vedic scriptures. The language Sanskrit lost its life and till today, this is the only language that could be used as programming language as it is, as the grammar of this language is structured so perfectly to develop logic from the language.

Somewhere down the line, the strengths of this civilization that has played a leadership role got eroded and became weaknesses of this civilization. There are many reasons for that. This civilization had core value of seeking knowledge for the purpose of achieving peace and tranquility in life. This civilization had extreme tolerance levels and this has resulted in aggression by other civilizations. Besides, the value of developing knowledge for the benefit of the community has slowly turned into pursuit of material benefits due to cross-pollination of civilizations. The leaders became the followers. Our core value of working hard, adapting to the changes, seeking knowledge remain in tact but the civilization lost its ability to lead.

Let the new generation not allow the cross-pollination of civilizations to affect the basic fabrics of the Indus-civilization. Instead, let them use other civilizations to learn the best values from them. Let them understand the conflicts of adapting the values of other civilizations. Let them gain strength to question the dangers to the society and not succumb to the pressure of evil. Let them lead by example to again become a vibrant civilization. If they don't, it will evolve into a "Regressive civilization".

I fully understand that poverty, corruption, politics as a profession as opposed to governance, etc. have eroded the value of otherwise vibrant Indus civilization. On the other hand, the core values of seeking knowledge, sacrifice for the welfare of the community, tolerance, etc. remain in tact. The value of right living continue to remain as primary fabric of the civilization. The new generation should focus on the right components of this civilization and spearhead the progress. If they understand building character and learning right living is the purpose of the civilization and if they are willing to lead, they can revolutionize this civilization to make progress and can proudly call it as "Progressive civilization".

Viswa

 

Dear Sri,

What a piece of composition! You have at last quoted something that I am familiar with, The Story of Mankind. This is a book that I have always liked immensely. And I think I once wrote up a snippet simply quoting the introductory page. I can't resist quoting once again.

This was my first introduction to time, a concept that has never ceased to fascinate me. But that's not what I should write about anymore. Instead, I want to concentrate on Yeats' line

Your granddaughter asked you a wonderfully innocent question. And she asked this question sitting in a world which has turned away its face from innocence almost totally. And I am wondering how I feel like answering the question. One possible name might fit the bill, though your granddaughter cannot be exposed to it. And that name is "The Uncivilized Civilization". I do think that we are lost. Or, as Yeats had put it:

Faith, beauty, love -- nothing matters anymore. Sensitivity in particular has lost all significance. Hendrik Van Loon, whom you refer to, wrote another book, The Life and Times of Rembrandt. I wrote a set of posts on this book too during my early days at IL. I was fascinated to know that Rembrandt had tried to portray the colour of air. And it was through this attempt that the world of painting underwent a magnificent change.

Have you ever thought of painting air, paint something that you can feel but hardly ever see? But Rembrandt took up that challenge. He brought about a revolution in art, that survived the test of time. He himself did not. He died a piteous death, no less touching than the one Mozart did.

No wonder we live in an age where

Fagin ran a school for pickpockets. Even he would shudder to be exposed to the centres of learning today!

oj

 

Dear Sri sir
Very interesting. I think unlike our history lessons, you made this interesting just because of the way you presented it.

India has come a long way from not only from the glorious Kalidasa, Aryabhaata, Nalnda, Guptas, and Cholas but also in abolishing Sati, Untouchability, casteism, etc. Good and bad. While science and technology have made the lifestyle much better in the cities, I saw not much improvement in the small villages during my travel to interior S.India. In fact my heart still bleeds when I recall the dilapidated mud homes, the poverty lines on those who chose to tend the fields with all the rivers including the Cauvery running dry.

If in a hundred years I was asked to define today's India, I would call it the period of corruption. I sincerely hope and pray that it has reached it pinnacle and from now on corruption will be on the decline. It may take a couple more generations to oppose corruption and finally eradicate it.

Discussions with some young folks in India revealed that they wish the British still ruled India and believe that India would have been a better place now.
I was stunned at their ignorance of the struggles our forefathers went through to gain this independence. Appears that this independence is not valued at all. Is it because they don't know what it is to be under another regime? Are the atrocities our forefathers went through and their struggles for freedom diluted so much that the present generation does not know the value of independence?
Perhaps this is because as you mention, our history lessons only glorify the past and do not focus on the real issues, the social struggles that the our forefathers fought against and changed the course of history.

I can think of a million ways this ignorance can be changed but realize that it is not easy.
________________________
Note: I read your article on vulnerability sir. I need a bit more time to put my thoughts to be more decipherable before giving my FB.