1. Have an Interesting Snippet to Share : Click Here
    Dismiss Notice

Dreading Documentaries

Discussion in 'Snippets of Life (Non-Fiction)' started by Balajee, Mar 5, 2015.

  1. Balajee

    Balajee IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    5,508
    Likes Received:
    4,486
    Trophy Points:
    338
    Gender:
    Male
    Amummy thanks for admitting that you don't have the nerve to watch the documentary. Yes the person whom you rightly call pervert casually gives all the revolting details.. But then the documentary goes on to show that how his attitude reflects the general attitude towards women in a male-dominated society where women are taken for granted. I suspect the that touched a raw nerve with the powers that be along with the fact that every 20 minute there is a rape in India. The government appears impotent in the documentary. and I think that is the reason for its hostile attitude. This is precisely why the documentary must be seen,. It shows the flip side of India.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. Balajee

    Balajee IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    5,508
    Likes Received:
    4,486
    Trophy Points:
    338
    Gender:
    Male
    Viswa, sorry I disagree with you. If you have noticed the cops were also interviewed on how the case got fast- tracked.. Within 16 days of the crime, the investigation was wrapped up and the accused were in police custody. This is also a pioneering case for police because for the first time dental forensics were used. to compare the accused's teeth marks with those found on Jyoti's body.All these details are there. BBC I don't thing hankers after TRP ratings and nor is it a sensation mongering media organisation like the Daily Som pr Mail. Far from that I see a note of pain running through the filmm a genuine pain at the lot of women in India that hasn't fundamentally changed despite their making great strides in many fields.
     
    1 person likes this.
  3. Balajee

    Balajee IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    5,508
    Likes Received:
    4,486
    Trophy Points:
    338
    Gender:
    Male
    Gauri03 yes you are right. Muzzling free expression is never a good idea. The way the documentary went viral on internet is a classic act of rebellion against such attempts. And there must be a free discussion on rape and the societal attitudes that lead to it. This is what the documentary does.
     
  4. Shanvy

    Shanvy IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    23,659
    Likes Received:
    27,218
    Trophy Points:
    590
    Gender:
    Female
    @gauri03 exactly why i feel that this documentary is not complete and is just a piece of sensationalism and i even felt anger about the channel going ahead and telecasting the same in spite of the ban, and some of the thoughts put forth by the director don't really go with what she claims are the reasons for putting forth a video and i wish this is does not go for a nomination.

    i also disagree on the indian daughter title. but the video definitely has reached to some people, like the boy(18-20yrs) who was taking down my list in the local grocery store was discussing with a customer

    "Sir, the juvenile boy should not be released sir, i can't think of how sick in the mind he should be to pull out and wrap it in cloth and throw. my blood boils., and i wish that the law in our country did not have so many loop holes.. and that po***u mukesh enna thenavatta interview kudukaran..enna dairyathula sir. ivvanellam amma/akka ellam illamaiyah periyavanugala ayitaan.. padikatha naangale thevala..law padichutu ippadi pesaraan..avanukku ponnu irrukka saar..paavam sir. (that mukesh, how cooly gave an interview..what gave him that.has he grown up without mom or sister..even illiterates like me are better sir. the one who has studied law, talking like this..does he have a daughter sir..i pity her sir..)

    I asked him if he undertood the video. he told me, i asked the owner to explain madam.

    So though i am not in support of the way things have gone with regards to the editing, the screening and more..i feel there is a chance. a chance for change. a change that starts happening with people starting to think, and not stop when the next sensational world cup match happens.

    @dsmenon, i completely agree with you. This country is a developing one, and we are not allowing it to grow in a the direction it should go, and are making it stunt like a bonsai in certain areas. and the media in this country is still in its teens, and acts like a teenager with raging hormones. mudslinging, attention seeking, temper tantrums and sensationalizing issues. the competition has pushed the quality to a side.

    We still are shy, and want certain things under cover. there is a lacuna between how it should be and how it is. and the number that lady put on some data of rapes and other things, was scary but we forget we are taking that data with relation to a 1.3billion population. and if the same were to be taken across with a ratio of crime to the population, the numbers would be different even for the so called super developed safe countries. i had got into arguments for stating the same. I seriously wonder if all of us can move out of a country stating security for our girl babies. So we all find a way.

    my daughter sent me this youtube sarcastic video once saying it was funny, but for me it was a blatant truth about our take on this issue. not that i complete agree with this video but i am taking it with a pinch of salt, because i know how my children were taught this particular chapter and how much half-baked knowledge was shared around the class and when i had to take matters into hand and talk about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiIxkOah09E

    I as a citizen,woman, mother want a better safety, a better society and i cannot expect the rulers of this country who change every 5 years to make it so. it is us the people, starting with your home, the street, the village that can make things happen. You start at home.

    My kids(19+ and 17) and me had a discussion on this video, and the content. in between the rightness of the nagaland mob killing the rapist also was discussed. My children said "killing a rapist" shows our quench for instantaneous results and nothing much. they went on to say, killing them, castrating them or hanging them in public is not the solution (As many want it) my daughter says "Mom, when a person sitting inside 4 walls for the past 2 years still thinks he has not done anything wrong, and talks about being right and warns that it could be even worse in future is a gone case. killing him is not going to help. killing the attitude, killing that thought that women are playthings but i do not know if it is possible and i know it looks like something out of paper" but if wishes were horses and can be possible, i would like to swish a magic wand that could bring in respect,safety for all not just woman.

    So most of the people, want better things. it is just 1% of the population that has these horrific animal tendencies. but yes the mental make and the skewed idea of keeping women safe can be up to a 10-15% of the population. (again i am just picking these percentage off the air and have no reference table.so please don't pick up on this...).

    Change is the only way to move forward and if the present gen mom's do educate their kids on values, respect both for others and self things would be better.
     
    2 people like this.
  5. Shanvy

    Shanvy IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    23,659
    Likes Received:
    27,218
    Trophy Points:
    590
    Gender:
    Female
    @balajee no this documentary only tries to show a .0001% of the societal attitude. I did not air my views of what i do no agree. i object to representing that all workers who live in poor conditions have the same mental make up. there was no proper balance in the documentary. if she were to show a few interviews of people who were working in call centre, the teenage girls on the locals, the men who travel along with these girls on locals and what they think about women. a random sampling would have given a better balance.

    The two defence lawyers must having been looking for their few minutes of fame and they got it.

    I feel there was more editing to make it look the way it looks to show what she wanted to show.

    But i agree we need to talk, thrash out the issues..debating is one medium that helps to kindle the thought process. nothing changed by keeping silent.
     
    3 people like this.
  6. vrikshakadali

    vrikshakadali Silver IL'ite

    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    88
    Trophy Points:
    68
    Gender:
    Female
    Haven't seen the documentary, but going by what I read on Internet. The interviewed rapist apparently describes how the Nirbhaya rape took place; also how he had earlier raped a 10 year old beggar girl and goes on to say that`she was just a beggar`. This kind of glorification of a brutal crime by the perpetrator is not allowed in many countries such as US where they have a Law called the `Son of Sam`. Rules were broken in 2013 (or bent as may be) when BBC and NDTV reporters collaborated to interview the rapist within the Tihar jail , the case being sub-judice as well. In April 2014 under the previous govt itself a notice was sent out to the producers. So GOI is within its rights to take action on the documentary makers.
     
  7. Gauri03

    Gauri03 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    6,211
    Likes Received:
    13,034
    Trophy Points:
    445
    Gender:
    Female
    I agree that we need to talk. A national debate on these subjects is very very necessary to bring about change. But I can't support this documentary for the reasons Shanvy has rightly articulated. I suspect the film-maker's objectivity. She claims that Bollywood movies are pornography and lead to rapes! How can you take this woman or her motives seriously? Paying a rapist incarcerated for a brutal crime to air some juicy sound-bytes is reprehensible, especially when the case is still subjudice. It shows a disdain and disrespect for India's judiciary. I know that we are no shining light when it comes to the justice system, but whatever system we have needs to be allowed to do its job.

    @Shanvy your comments about working class men reminded me of this dhobi (washerman) who used to do our laundry when I was in high school. This man had 3 daughters. One day he asked my mother if I could teach math and science to his girls, and in return he would do our sheets for free. This was a poor illiterate man, and with his wife he did back breaking work to send his daughters went to an English-medium school. They were always dressed in the best-starched school uniforms. :) I did teach his daughters for two summers. Not all poor Indian men are closet rapists who objectify women. What have all the millions of ordinary Indian men done to deserve being lumped with these rabid criminals? Why should they be made to feel ashamed of themselves?

    Let's all watch the documentary. Hiding our heads in the sand won't help. But let's not get carried away by the 'British Film-maker' and 'BBC' tags. Let's judge it on its own merits. So far I'm not convinced this documentary addresses the problem the way it needs to be addressed.
     
    6 people like this.
  8. Balajee

    Balajee IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    5,508
    Likes Received:
    4,486
    Trophy Points:
    338
    Gender:
    Male
    Shanvy you will be happy to know that the two repulsive lawyers now face action from the bar council that could include their being barred from practicing la. True, the documentary could have had more details like the tendency to nudge and paw in buses and local trains but it does not generalize that all people coming from slums are evil. It just said such environments engender criminals.Yes from a cinematic poit of view it does leave a lot to be desired. But from a content point of view while it is not perfect it hits the bulls' eye..
     
    2 people like this.
  9. Balajee

    Balajee IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    5,508
    Likes Received:
    4,486
    Trophy Points:
    338
    Gender:
    Male
    Rapes also take place in workplaces by educated upeer crust people Workplace sexual harassment is a major plague and surveys have shown that it is widespread. So no point in blaming some slum dwellers alone. But we cannot deny that when people live in dehumanizing conditions, they become dehumanized and their behavioral patterns are quite different from the rest. As Mukesh Singh's interview showed he lacked humanity. He was describing the whole rape episode in a casual feelingless manner.
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. sokanasanah

    sokanasanah IL Hall of Fame

    Messages:
    3,959
    Likes Received:
    6,862
    Trophy Points:
    408
    Gender:
    Male
    I have not seen the documentary. Here are some thoughts based on what I have read about it:

    (a) It appears as if the filmmaker did get the requisite permits to make the film. So, on the whole it is the Indian authorities that dropped the ball.

    (b) The matter is still sub-judice. There are appeals pending. This being the case, permission for making a film should not have been granted. Even if permission had been granted, the actual broadcast should have been prohibited until after the case had been concluded.

    (c) Allowing room for the due process of law is an important aspect of development, especially in emotionally fraught cases such as this one. The mob ‘justice’ in Nagaland is nothing to be proud of.

    (d) I do not trust the editorial views of the Ms. Udwin. She tars with a broad brush. Some of the statements attributed to her are outrageous, if indeed she made them. She may be forgivably prone to ‘panic attacks’, but the statements attributed to her enlightened daughter do not ring true to my ear. I doubt her sincerity.

    (e) The payment of cash for an interview is deplorable. In many legal systems, profiting from a crime is prohibited by law. I am not so enamored of the BBC as to be reflexively impressed.

    (f) Having said that, I think the statements captured on film from the rapist and his lawyer represent a coup. Those segments of the film do capture the banality of evil. The despicable statements by the lawyer are a sad reflection of the sate of legal education in India.

    More in a separate post.
     
    3 people like this.

Share This Page