Discussion in 'Married Life' started by Madhurima, Nov 8, 2007.
Sad to think of how warped logic is used to support the indefensible.
There had been a lot of acrimonious exchanges among participants here on this issue. It means , the issue is kept dormant in everybody's mind but whenever there is an outlet, there is an explosion. Sharply divided opinions I have observed. But, to be very frank, I feel there are lot of bitter truths hidden in the posts on both sides and needless to say, it is not at all a gender-centric issue, and not that husbands are only responsible. The givers, the takers, the provocateurs and the status-quoism , social protocol , rituals , culture everything together make the issue as is now seen today.
Firstly lets look at the taker's side i.e husband's side.
Here, greed, status quoism, exhibitionism and off course status - everything is working. The husbands, either willingly, greedily or under pressure are falling preys to the dowry demands and subsequent realizations. He and his family members may proudly show, what the bride's family have given. In a sense, it is an indicator of his market value, ability to catch sizable fish and such many other parameters . If some government job has been somehow managed by the husband by underhand dealing of money, say 10/20/25 lacs, he will realize it from father-in-law. he can start his new life without a debt.
Thought of husband : I am not greedy. Her money / ornaments will remain hers. What's wrong if she gets something from her own father? No no I shall not meddle in her own matter. If she comes with a bagful of things she is welcome, and if she comes empty - handed still she is welcome but how can I guarantee for my father / mother and other relatives?
Thought of FIL : If Ravi gets this much, he can give the margin money for the new flat and the car. A part of the money , I can use for the repair of my own house, few ornaments can also arranged for Puja's wedding. A fixed deposit can be in the name of Ravi and DIL. After all I spent a lot for his education. In return, I can expect this small consideration
Thought of MIL : Why not ? It today's market prices, can anything be free? We are no Tatas Birlas . We are to purchase everything from market. Apart from these, what the relatives and neighbourhood people will say? Have we brought a girl from a beggar's house?
Thought on the bride's side.
Father : It seems , the boy has some status and value. It may come to use in my business and in my beradari, fraternity , I can flaunt the son-in-law, the way a horse owner flaunts his new purchase with the jockey ( his daughter). When my assistants are damn busy, I ask my Son-In-Law to assist my son. If I can set my SIL on my son, both will fight and I may get proper inputs. My own DIL will also be silenced and my daughter will be happy .
Brother : My father has ten crore property . If the sister can be disposed by only 50 lacs, it is still all plus for me for future, Just get her signature on a stamp paper with two witnesses.
Mother : My daughter should go to the in-laws with her head high. Some financial security will also be with her for bad times. What the relatives will say, if she goes to sasural empty - handed ? Don't we have respect in society? I can also call few shots in damad's family, after all we have given them a good dowry. It is now that my daughter will wrest the control of the household and put the old lady on the sideline. I shall have to arrange a suitable sim card , just to keep a tab on the latest in her family. After all, my advocate is good one and he can slap 498A anytime when I give green signal. All the damad's people will turn into official guests of the CID.
Bride herself : Who knows , what I will get in future from father, so let me take it as a one-time-settlement. I don't how are the people in my in-law's side. They may say my father has deprived me. They will talk ill about our family. But what to do, I need some security also. If security and respect both can be earned by some dowry, why say no to it?
Neighbourhood people thought : Oh! yes, Tinni's daddy is a balanced person. He spent exactly the same amount on his elder daughter, and the younger daughter is also not deprived. But he has made our job difficult. Dowries are good for others but not for me. My DIL will certainly bring dowry, but why I shall have to give dowry for my daughter. Ye Kambhakht Anil Bhai, humara kaam thoda badha diya, non-sense.
These are the common thoughts. But I have not spoken about those people, who do not look for dowry at all. Neither grooms side, nor bride's side. There thoughts are the inputs for the good model essays against dowries. So, I did not make my own essay lengthier.
Conclusion : Please don't see the issue as a gender war : There are males females on both sides, whose thoughts do not make a resonate with the thoughts of the right thinking noble ladies and some men here.
True. It is a social evil at the bottom of which are perverted, misled, warped priorities. The only thing that can set things right is bringing about awareness and everyone concerned doing the right thing. Basically the solution lies in one's own hands.
Hope these guys respect their mothers at least. I beg you (as a lesser human - a woman ), kindly do the woman-kind a favor by not marrying.
Marriage is so much more than a financial transaction. I feel pity on those who have not seen or experienced the company, warmth and love of an affectionate family. FYI, many the women(working for pay or not ) earn much much more than what costs for their "upkeep". And they have partners who cherish them for what they bring in to the relation as opposed to "how much".
ps : I am not saying that all women are great just as I am not saying that all men are chauvinists.
It will be good if the women, who have received their rightful share in their father's property equal to their brothers, take care of their parents in their old age. However, this cannot be a pre-condition for receiving their share. After all, do sons always take care of their ageing parents after receiving the property? A son may very well go abroad to settle. Can he take care of parents? He may take a job in a different city and the parents may not be ready to move with him due to several reasons, e.g., attachment to their village, town, house, land, fields, ancestral property, some old trade they may be pursuing etc. etc. There may be other reasons also. Will such sons forego their share in father's property?
We read innumerable cases in newspapers in which sons have been misbehaving with their parents and throwing the parents out of the house, after the property is handed over to them. There are so many such cases that the government had to make special laws to deal with such cases. We regularly read about court cases in which the judge has ordered a son to pay maintenance to his aged parents.
That is why parents should not give property to son or daughter in their life time.If the son or daughter does not care for them ,parents have the choice of not giving anything as long as it was earned by parents. If they received from their ancestor...then they may need to share with their children.
That is why women should not be given dowry...instead they should be given their share in parents property in the will of the parents.Son ,daughter,son in law,daughter in law should have the decency to wait for their parents to pass them the property after their demise.
Basically, you are saying that you are doing household work. As I have already written in my previous posts, there is very little such work involved today in a home due to changing technology etc. Whatever work is there is very minimal and greatly simplified. Mostly servants do the work or modern gadgets and machines. Many things we get done from the market which were previously done at home. We also purchase ready-made things from the market today which were previously made at home.
Secondly, you are forgetting men's additional contribution to the family besides earning. Men do not just earn for the family but also handle several other very important jobs. They handle jobs related with the outside world and these are very important and very difficult, unlike household jobs. Some of these jobs are house maintenance, healthcare for family members, renting or purchasing house, car maintenance, school admissions, paying bills, arranging outstation trips and entertainment, investment decisions, vehicle/RTO related jobs, arranging tuitions for children if required, insurance, banking and post-office related work, police verification of servant/tenant, handling medical and other emergencies, getting a lawyer/CA if needed etc. etc. The list is endless. A husband also drives family vehicle but never demands any compensation for that. Women always point-out about the household work they do whereas men silently work. They never demand, even realize, their true worth or position in the family.
May be the woman in your circles do not do anything.......I and most women I know do most of the jobs listed under husband's chores by you.
Forget me...now my daughter drives us around while we sit at the back and enjoy. By daughter has taken over most bank and post related chores from me.
I am the one who suggests and researches all investments including property and thankfully all have given us good profits.
Every few years my husband gets transferred and I am the one who packs up our home and then sets up the home in the new place.
I am the one who has been fully responsible for my daughters admissions,change of schools ,educations ,tuitions ,extra curricular classes etc.
I am the one who took them to doctor for regular check ups .
My husband can leave us and go for duty to other places because I hold the fort at home.
You may find it hard to believe it...but I am the nucleus of my family.
Totally agree with you @yellowmango.......most of the women are taking care of outside works so efficiently.
I am a working woman, living abroad......When we planned to buy a house here, I was the person who searched for the properties, spoke to estate agents, booked appointments for viewing, arranged all the paper work for Solicitor, co-ordinated with the solicitor through out the process. I was so happy to handle all these works, I never felt it as burden.....I was happy for my hubby that I reduced a lot of work for him. Only thing I left to my hubby was to speak to the bank people and to just sign the papers along with me. Also I did most of the work in packing things and arranging in new house.
My DH always tells our friends so proudly that, my wife managed the house purchasing process and managed everything single handed and so efficiently. So end of the day what else we need, a small compliment & appreciation for the hard work.
As Mr. Agarwal mentioned, may be there are washing machines and grinders to do bit of job, We do not get maids here. So I do all other household works & cooking.
It's not as simple as he mentioned. Working at office and Managing house are not simple tasks.
How much ever may be the work, We women always feel that we are doing it for our family & for our house. We never complain about the hard work we do.
Mr JKAgarwal, lets look at your very important and most difficult jobs that you do.
Frequency: 3-4 times a year
What does it require for you: Find a handyman to fix the issue. Talk to neighbors, friends for a recommendation of handyman or search online through handyman sites or yellow pages. Call the handyman, agree on the price and ask him to do.
What does wife have to do: Clear the clutter so that handy man can work. Once the work is done, clean the area and organize the things moved.
Mr JKAgarwal, which is more difficult?
Health care of family members:
Frequency: 4-6 times a year (just estimating)
What does it require for you: Call the doctor at home or take the person the hospital/doctor. Buy prescription from the pharmacy.
What does wife have to do: Prepare separate food for the patient, make sure to give medicines on time, provide home remedies to the patient, help patient with daily hygiene.
Mr JKAgarwal which is more difficult?
Renting or purchasing a house:
Frequency: Once or twice in a lifetime or once every 11 months if renting frequently.
What does it require for you: Hire an agent and then travel to see the property. Pay the deposit.
What does wife have to do: Pack up the kitchen, clothes, other items, clean the house, unpack the kitchen, clothes and other items. Organize it in the new house.
Mr. JKAgarwal which is more difficult?
Frequency: Once every 3 months.
What does it require for you: Take the car to the dealer and get it done.
Mr. JKAgarwal Is this difficult?
Frequency: Once for every child
What does it require for you: Ask neighbors, friends for good schools. Visit the school and secure admission.
What does the wife have to do: Prepare the child for school daily - wake up the child, get the child ready, prepare lunch for the child, pickup/drop off the child daily to the school or to the school bus. Help the child with the homework.
Mr. JK Agarwal which one is more difficult?
Paying bills, outstation trips, Insurance, bank, post office (outdated now)
Frequency: Once a month
What do you have to do: Go to the website and arrange. Get referrals from neighbors, friends and arrange.
Mr. JK Agarwal is this difficult?
Now look at wife's activities.
Frequency: Two to four times a day
What do you have to do: Order wife to make tea for yourself or for your guests.
Wife: Make sure the required grocery are in the house. Boil the milk in the morning when it comes. Prepare the tea, pour them in the cups and bring it along with snacks or breakfast. Afterwards put the utensils in the kitchen and clean them up.
Mr. JK Agarwal which one is more difficult?
Frequency: two to three times a day.
What do you have to do: Order what you want to eat for yourself or for your guests.
Wife: Bring groceries, clean them, cut them, prepare the veggies, prepare the rotis, clean the utensils and cleanup after the meal.
Mr. JK Agarwal which one is more difficult?
Unless you are filthy rich and have 24 hours maid and cook at home, wife has to do the work daily. I doubt you are filthy rich as you have nothing to do but argue with ladies on a ladies website.
Regarding all the Mahaan tasks that you think you are doing, give me your bank account number and other details, I will do it for you sitting here in US.