Chatter & Banter - Politics In India

Discussion in 'News & Politics' started by Viswamitra, Sep 30, 2018.

  1. Viswamitra

    Viswamitra IL Hall of Fame

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    Review of the Symbols above will indicate what we intend to discuss here. The symbols of parties that existed for a long period of time and at least ruled more than one state are included above. Bring on anything and everything that you would like to discuss with reference to Indian politics. Even if it involves the decisions of Supreme Court that affects the religion, politics, social fabrics, etc., you could write it up here.

     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
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  2. Gauri03

    Gauri03 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Thanks for the thread Viswa. The recent string of progressive verdicts (377, Sabarimala and decriminalization of adultery) are being credited to Chief Justice Misra's desire to establish a legacy before he retires. You know what impressed me most? Supreme Court judges in India actually RETIRE! How democratic! Now there is something the US can learn from a so-called developing country.

    Also, what are everyone's suggestions on reliable, unbiased news sources about current affairs in India?
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
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  3. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Thank you for the thread Viswa.
    From the reactions of men in the family and friends circle to the Sabarimala verdict, I believe nothing will change for the women, regardless of the verdict. Goodness, I want to unfollow and unfriend the lot of them!

    Thank God for the decriminalization of same-sex interactions and adultery. It's a step in the right direction. Wonder when no contest divorce will be added to the list.
     
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  4. Amulet

    Amulet IL Hall of Fame

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    I want this to happen as soon as possible. The family courts in India are in such under-capacity to deal with the number of cases that are pending. Even cases that are simple -- no kids, no property division issues-- languish for years in the queue. If a few states could set up Las Vegas type schemes for quick marriages and divorces, they could make a lot of money from tourism. It would be like medical tourism for mental health. Instead of a fake Elvis Presley as the witness at the event, we could have a fake MGR/Rajni or some Kapoor/khan doppelganger doing that. Life could be so sweet for so many.
     
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  5. Rihana

    Rihana Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Viswa my friend, thank you for the thread. I am now getting most of my U.S. and Indian news from IL, including pointers on what to read outside IL, so this is a timely thread. But ....... did you really have to put Serial Kisser ka video in first post? Some Comet bleach I will need to cleanse the mind. : ) As penance, you can watch this video by Shankar Mahadevan A Tribute to Non-Stop India.

    j/k.. good the thread was started. Most likely otherwise I would continue to only glance at rediff few minutes a week. Hopefully from this thread I will get to know more of the Indian news and what the citizens think.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2018
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  6. Rihana

    Rihana Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    About the Indian SC's ruling on Sabarimala --

    When the rights of two groups clash, and both cannot be upheld, which group's rights should be upheld? In the Sabarimala case, what about the rights of the men to worship their deity the way they want to and are required to? A horrible unholy analogy, but to me it is like the rights of non-smokers to inhale freely versus the rights of smokers to smoke in public places.

    If the movement was to get the priests and temple management to change rules, it would have some support from me. The SC ruling in such a case, no.

    A place of worship might belong to the people and technically be a public place (are Sabarimala, Tirupati etc privately owned?) but its rules can be different than other public places such as govt offices, community centers.

    These are my views. They are subject to change. I am not up to date on the topic. No intent at all to hurt the feelings of any person or any gender, identity or community. LOL that sounded like the message at the start of movies.

    The following short video pretty much sums up my views. She is quite eloquent. Liked how she speaks.
    Link to the video.

     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2018
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  7. Rihana

    Rihana Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    What I didn't care much for related to Sabarimala worshippers was when one colleague bound for Sabarimala mostly stopped talking to the three females in the group, and one day came to my cubicle, and placed the floppy disk on the table, avoiding the hand I had stretched out to take it. I was too young, raw and plain grateful for the opportunity to work there to even think I or we could complain to HR. We could have. We did get the rule changed about what was appropriate formal wear for women. A gaggle of us young gals (su-kumaris as we were called : ) ) were the talk of the company for a few weeks after we successfully explained to HR that "pants" and "jeans" were not the same. : )
     
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  8. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Sabarimala isn't a HINDU temple. It is a temple for all people who follow any religion. Before going up the 18 steps to see Ayyapan, you have to go and pay obeisance to Vayar a Muslim. It is the first of it's kind in Kerala, where people of all castes, including the lower caste, could freely visit the lord and worship him. Kerala temples have banned people of lower castes to go pray because of the purity of the deity. If that rule can be abolished, then so can this.

    The rule that menstruating women shouldn't enter Sabarimala isn't something that started with the temple. Women always went and visited and prayed. Kerala HC passed a ruling in 1991 banning women between 10-50 to enter the temple. The SC ruling just overturned the Kerala HC ruling. If Kerala HC can get involved in temples and their sanctums, then why can't the SC pass a judgment? If courts, in general, need to step out of the arena, then the Kerala HC verdict that people want to uphold won't exist.

    The subsect of people who are involved with the temple is from an old line of Matriarchy. I don't believe for a second that ages ago when women ruled the roost, they weren't allowed in the shrine. To the contrary, I believe they probably went and prayed without the traditional irumudi and that's possible to do, even now.

    Regarding the arduous trek, availability of safe places to stay etc, the devaswom collecting thousands of crores of rupees in donations should make the trek safer for men and women. They should use some of the money to upkeep the place.

    Should the govt have a say in the money? Absolutely. I don't trust the trustees of any temple. Fund mismanagement is aplenty. The temple boards are standing behind these so-called ready to wait supporters to get their way with the funds. With the courts enabling women to enter the shrine, the next logical step will be to take a look at the money the place generates. It's the number one cash generator in the country. If they have nothing to hide, why worry. Their worry is the money, not if women can come or not.
     
  9. Rihana

    Rihana Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    According to that video, Lord Ayyappan's guide or guru or someone laid down the rules for him, and those rules or a sub-set of them are applied to Ayyappan's worshipers. If a devotee or worshiper believes in the deity, he/she will want to follow the rules.
     
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  10. Laks09

    Laks09 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    False. Ayyapan himself decided to become a Brahmachari so that his stepmom won't have to worry about his children taking over the Pandalam kingdom. His step brother's line is that subset of people. These gurus and guides all came about later, deviations from the original story.
    Yes, the same thing was said to people of lower castes trying to enter Guruvayur after the courts intervened and let them enter. They were told that if they were a true worshipper of Guruvayurappan then they would rather follow the rules and not pollute the deity with their presence in the temple.

    All this propaganda about true women believers waiting to go is on similar lines. I wonder how this lady knows that people who want to go now are going not to pray but to entertain themselves. How does she know that the Muslim person who went to the SC is a non-believer? Because he's a Muslim? Vaavar swami is a Muslim and is present in Sabarimala so any Indian can technically challenge a temple rule without going into the Hindu/Muslim discussion. Every person who thinks a Muslim cannot have opinions or rights on Sabarimala just don't know the Lord of the hill. He deemed it okay for Muslims to come and see him and he didn't ever say that he was a lord only of the Hindus.
     

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