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One Sacrifices ;others Enjoy

Discussion in 'Snippets of Life (Non-Fiction)' started by jayasala42, Sep 22, 2017.

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Sep 25, 2017 #41

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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jayasala42 said: ↑

Dear Iravati,
A fantastic response from altogether different angle.You are right.The act of declaring that a particular activity was done with no self interest itself shows some selfish motive.Even now we see many people that tom-tom having contributed so much to charitable institutions.If they are really contributing, their remarks can be well ignored.
You have inter alia made a reference to a much debated topic on
reciprocal altruism' of which I have read in some scientific journals.
Even human psychology we are unable to analyse, not to talk of ants, birds and rats.On many occasions we are amazed at the tendency of ants and honey bees.Once upon a time crows were considered to be generous and as soon as they get some food they simply start making 'caw' sounds and share what they had.But crows today are very shrewd and they don't keep the food in their beaks but just hide them underneath and start eating once the companions leave the place.
" the selflessness is the outlet of selfishness of the genes' scientists say.
Almost all the activities of human beings cannot be categorized under'sacrifice' There is some element of compensation not necessarily financial, but in alternate forms of pride ,prestige, challenge and other sociological factors.Of course for trees, plants and rivers
there are certain biological factors that contribute to the selfless acts.
Thanks again for the introspective response.

jayasala 42
Click to expand...

Mind boggling incisive fantastic all embracing!thanks. Regards.

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

#41
Sep 25, 2017 #42

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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jayasala42 said: ↑

Dear Iravati,
A fantastic response from altogether different angle.You are right.The act of declaring that a particular activity was done with no self interest itself shows some selfish motive.Even now we see many people that tom-tom having contributed so much to charitable institutions.If they are really contributing, their remarks can be well ignored.
You have inter alia made a reference to a much debated topic on
reciprocal altruism' of which I have read in some scientific journals.
Even human psychology we are unable to analyse, not to talk of ants, birds and rats.On many occasions we are amazed at the tendency of ants and honey bees.Once upon a time crows were considered to be generous and as soon as they get some food they simply start making 'caw' sounds and share what they had.But crows today are very shrewd and they don't keep the food in their beaks but just hide them underneath and start eating once the companions leave the place.
" the selflessness is the outlet of selfishness of the genes' scientists say.
Almost all the activities of human beings cannot be categorized under'sacrifice' There is some element of compensation not necessarily financial, but in alternate forms of pride ,prestige, challenge and other sociological factors.Of course for trees, plants and rivers
there are certain biological factors that contribute to the selfless acts.
Thanks again for the introspective response.

jayasala 42
Click to expand...

Mind boggling incisive fantastic all embracing!thanks. Regards.

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

#42
Sep 25, 2017 #43

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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jayasala42 said: ↑

Dear Iravati,
A fantastic response from altogether different angle.You are right.The act of declaring that a particular activity was done with no self interest itself shows some selfish motive.Even now we see many people that tom-tom having contributed so much to charitable institutions.If they are really contributing, their remarks can be well ignored.
You have inter alia made a reference to a much debated topic on
reciprocal altruism' of which I have read in some scientific journals.
Even human psychology we are unable to analyse, not to talk of ants, birds and rats.On many occasions we are amazed at the tendency of ants and honey bees.Once upon a time crows were considered to be generous and as soon as they get some food they simply start making 'caw' sounds and share what they had.But crows today are very shrewd and they don't keep the food in their beaks but just hide them underneath and start eating once the companions leave the place.
" the selflessness is the outlet of selfishness of the genes' scientists say.
Almost all the activities of human beings cannot be categorized under'sacrifice' There is some element of compensation not necessarily financial, but in alternate forms of pride ,prestige, challenge and other sociological factors.Of course for trees, plants and rivers
there are certain biological factors that contribute to the selfless acts.
Thanks again for the introspective response.

jayasala 42
Click to expand...

Mind boggling incisive fantastic all embracing!thanks. Regards.

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

#43
Sep 25, 2017 #44

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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Iravati said: ↑

Sacrifice has a romanticized glow to it. When you utter, "I have sacrificed to be" instead of "I have chosen to be", it strikes as claim to selflessness of having put the welfare of others before yours. Sacrifices are only noble in letter but not in spirit as there are hardly any silent sacrifices. By "silent" sacrifice, I mean a sacrifice where the sacrificing party does not capitalise on the noble act. A sibling working abroad to feed the rest of the family or parents enabling a lifestyle/education that is beyond their means to their kids never muffle their excitement on these cherished acts. They would probably blare to the whole neighbourhood and gloat on such "nobility". Is that a sacrifice? In return for such compassionate and derived fame, they are willing to withdraw from direct gains. Is that still a sacrifice?

On a denser note, "chained sacrifice" or in scientific terms known as "reciprocal altruism" is a well-researched topic. Why do ants form a hierarchical society wherein some ants give up reproduction to take care of the baby ants of their siblings? How do ants even organise into such queen, worker and nanny roles? Who is sacrificing and are those sacrifices being compensated elsewhere as social rewards in that close-chained network. W.D Hamilton, E.O Wilson, Robert Trivers and others have thoroughly examined this field and came up with very interesting findings. Their theories are a staple in evolutionary biology and sociobiology.

On a lighter note, people who claim that they have sacrificed with no self-interest should be thwarted that the very act of declaration has controverted their intention.
Click to expand...

It is nice to read a bit of entomology linked to sacrifice. Very apt and something fundamental requirement innate to evolution. . Regards.

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 25, 2017

#44
Sep 26, 2017 #45

momsky Gold IL'ite

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Looking back at my own experience, I think it's better to juggle and balance family, children and career at the same time, instead of sacrificing one's career or dream altogether. I gave up mine and never regretted it until my children recently discovered that my childhood/college friends are vp, coo, director, etc. for multinational companies in Linkedin. They were so amazed but they don't know I had an outstanding record as a management trainee for a large international company at 23 years old, I could have that kind of position by now.

All in all, it's really important to keep everyone happy, including one's self. No point in sacrificing if it will affect us mentally... In 9 years, I'll be 44 and all my children will be in university. They asked me if I'll go for corporate again.. told them no way, not sure what i'll do really.. but i fancy working in film sets

momsky, Sep 26, 2017

momsky, Sep 26, 2017

#45

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Sep 26, 2017 #46

jayasala42 IL Hall of Fame

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Dear Momsky,
Thank you very much for the response.In 1964, when I was just 22, I had a really enviable job, topping the 50 candidates ( 49 men).I had to leave my career for the sake of family, to look after my husband's grandfather and my mother-in-law.I had no children then.I had to take up a relatively junior position to avoid transfer and keep it somewhat balancing. While my colleagues retired as EDs and Chief General managers ,I had to retire in a junior position.But I was able to do full justice to my family as well as official duties.
As you rightly said, there is some balancing force.If we don't do it, it is automatically done.Either we can be totally committed to office work or do some justification by sacrificing the job status.We can't have the cake and eat it too, unless we are politically
influential to get posting in the same city for ever.

Jayasala 42

jayasala42, Sep 26, 2017

jayasala42, Sep 26, 2017

#46

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Sep 26, 2017 #47

Nonya Platinum IL'ite

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jayasala42 said: ↑

Dear Momsky,
Thank you very much for the response.In 1964, when I was just 22, I had a really enviable job, topping the 50 candidates ( 49 men).I had to leave my career for the sake of family, to look after my husband's grandfather and my mother-in-law.I had no children then.I had to take up a relatively junior position to avoid transfer and keep it somewhat balancing. While my colleagues retired as EDs and Chief General managers ,I had to retire in a junior position.But I was able to do full justice to my family as well as official duties.
As you rightly said, there is some balancing force.If we don't do it, it is automatically done.Either we can be totally committed to office work or do some justification by sacrificing the job status.We can't have the cake and eat it too, unless we are politically
influential to get posting in the same city for ever.
Jayasala 42
Click to expand...

When JS-22 was convinced (forced?) to give up the opportunity to do the best she can in her career, it appears that she was the hostage to the situation.
Would a 22 year old banker in the current India choose to be part-time nursemaid to old in-laws or would she outsource the function to hired-hands, and take care of her career ?

Here are some question that slosh up in my mind, and JS42 can totally ignore these.
1. How did Mr. JS42 do in his career ? Did the total family income compensate for the loss of a meaningful career and earnings of JS22 ?
2. How did Mr. JS42 compensate the Mrs for a lifelong angst ?
3. Do jobs with less responsibility offer more mental peace, albeit lower salaries, and retirement benefits ?

Nonya, Sep 26, 2017

Nonya, Sep 26, 2017

#47

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Sep 26, 2017 #48

rgsrinivasan IL Hall of Fame

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Quite an interesting post, Madam. Actually the very word "gratitude" seems not to be understood by many these days. And those who claim to have sacrificed everything, do not admit that it was their choice at that point of time. Seems they want to get some things for themselves at a much latter stage and when they neither have the wealth nor health, they wallow in self pity, and start complaining more and more.

You would have surely read about Yudhishtra's interpretation of the dream of one of his subjects where the person says that one well overflows and fills 7 other small wells, but all the 7 could not give enough to the well that fed them water.

Life seems to be a pretty short journey and the young and fit days are a one-time roller-coaster ride. The best thing to do is to live for ourselves and do what is important and right at all times. It is easier said though. -rgs

rgsrinivasan, Sep 26, 2017

rgsrinivasan, Sep 26, 2017

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Sep 26, 2017 #49

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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momsky said: ↑

All in all, it's really important to keep everyone happy, including one's self. No point in sacrificing if it will affect us mentally... In 9 years, I'll be 44 and all my children will be in university. They asked me if I'll go for corporate again.. told them no way, not sure what i'll do really.. but i fancy working in film sets
Click to expand...

having been used to sharing and spending quality time in their formative years, you may prefer to continue to share time with family. but they have all grown up going to go their ways during wakeful hours, wisdom would therefore dictate to utilize your corporate expertise and same time add to the kitty which would turn into icing over the cake! With my blessings and God's too. regards. Thanks.

Thyagarajan, Sep 26, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 26, 2017

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momsky likes this.
Sep 26, 2017 #50

Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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jayasala42 said: ↑

Thank you very much for the response.In 1964, when I was just 22, I had a really enviable job, topping the 50 candidates ( 49 men).I had to leave my career for the sake of family, to look after my husband's grandfather and my mother-in-law. I had no children then
Click to expand...

Quite a situation especially for a lady just married. But in ultimate analysis, one would find the decision to accept a lower or junior post had kept you with a golden mind in robust body! The situation is different. life has become very costly. Maintaining a home and family with numerous ever increasing wants need more finance and balancing career and home is the only option for young couple. Thanks and Regards. God Bless us all.

Thyagarajan, Sep 26, 2017

Thyagarajan, Sep 26, 2017

#50

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