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Gabfest: And Thereby Hangs A Tail

Discussion in 'Education & Personal Growth' started by Cimorene, Jan 9, 2017.

  1. kaniths

    kaniths IL Hall of Fame

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    Ditto, ditto! We did get there. :beer-toast1: Good to know the background workings as well, makes the thought processing meaningful I guess. There is more clarity in my head now. :innocent:

    What I had missed to take in account. :blush:

    Profound. :thumbsup:
     
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  2. kaniths

    kaniths IL Hall of Fame

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    ...like this?

    BotAI~01.jpg

    :roflmao: Lol.
     
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  3. Sweety2016

    Sweety2016 Gold IL'ite

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    My few cents: Though the question was directed to Gauri, I am taking the liberty to discuss it from a different perspective..

    What do you think of nature's designs (say the ecosystem) vs anything man-made?

    Natures design as you all said is multidimensional and highly nonlinear. One of my professors asked us a question, Which is the most compact heat exchanger that provides the maximum efficiency and who made it? We started shouting out GM, Tesla, NASA etc. He gave a thoughtful smile and said, 'No. All of you are wrong. the answer is human lungs and the manufacturer is GOD'...different types of heat exchangers have come up in the industry but none of it has reached even 50% efficiency...Forget about creating a prototype of lungs, it is even difficult to model the lungs theoretically and perform the coupled fluid dynamics (to understand the flow of air inside the lungs) and reaction (oxygen reacting with Haemoglobin and CO2 expelling out) analysis by using the most sophisticated simulation tools. So nature's design is beyond comprehension and a life time is not sufficient to understand even a fraction of it!

    Is our design thinking mostly linear and perhaps one dimensional as opposed to nature's complex, multitudinous ideas?

    Yes. Man made things are assumptions driven which by itself simplifies the entire design to a great extent.

    For eg. We always model flow in a single direction mostly say (x) whereas there is actually flow happening in the other directions as well (y and z). We ignore this because the pressure gradients are too large in the x direction that y and z flow velocities become negligible enough that we don’t take them into consideration. This is why solving navier stoke’s equation is still a millennial problem though we still use the equation almost everywhere and what we get is approximate solutions which is sufficient enough to develop a system.

    This is also the reason why the observed efficiencies are always less than the theoretical efficiencies in any system.

    Why our designs exhibit orderliness all the time while nature allows chaos and messy interactions within its design?

    This is what we call entropy or randomness or measure of disorder from thermodynamics point of view. All the power plants are designed on the assumption that the process is isentropic (entropy remains constant)..This assumption is very important and this is what has taken us to where we are today when it comes to power generation from a time, million years ago, when early man generated power or heat energy by rubbing stones. Had we included the entropy property as well, it would have been very difficult to even conceive a problem, visualize it and hence model it… We would not have reached to what we are today. Now once the system is developed, we perform experimental studies and try to understand the underlying physics which would help us optimize it and maximize its potential.

    But the good news is that, we human beings have exhibited enormous willingness to think and understand the nature... So nature’s design though is superior and above the comprehension of human beings, its design and evolution is highly probabilistic and spontaneity driven.. This is why even today we are still trying to understand everything related to the universe.. So many discoveries and inventions have been made, several theories have been proposed, industrial revolution happened, application of fundamentals helped us in developing machines and diverse interdisciplinary fields of study have come into existence..We are much better of what we were a few hundred years back and this can be attributed to the inquisitiveness of human race!


    And, nature's approach is decentralized?


    Yes. This is the reason that we dont have one special law that would govern the entire universe. Every phenomenon happening around us though linked at some level with certain parameters, has its own governing equations and laws.
     
  4. Sweety2016

    Sweety2016 Gold IL'ite

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    AI I see....thats fascinating....Deepmind or neuralink?? these are the only companies I know:)
     
  5. Viswamitra

    Viswamitra IL Hall of Fame

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    @Sweety2016,

    Very well articulated. I would go one step ahead and say that the design and research concepts are created from the limited knowledge of the functions of the universe and if we understand the baseline equation that ties all of them together, our inventions will be phenomenal. There are so many systems that function inside our body automatically with no input from the brain. Brain is just a controller and every organ and cell have their own intelligence. We only project the brain as the superpower like Boeing assembling the plane and rolling out while so many manufacturers make smaller parts with so much precision.
     
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  6. Thyagarajan

    Thyagarajan IL Hall of Fame

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    I am sure you would bSharing the golden yellow cubes with
    :hello:That reminds me of summer holidays in then Bombay, when spouse & I with our racket had gone to join with young couple to play shuttle at 5am.
    The play court was at stone throw.
    We left sleeping kids son 8 and daughter nearing 2 at home.

    When game was through, son carrying sister on his shoulder with their tiny plastic rackette appeared at open court. Normally their warm up time around 20 to 30 minutes from the time they wake up.

    I was wondering how in a space of 10 to 15 minutes they appeared at the court. My boy explained:
    "SHE WENT FOR TWO & I TOO finished the two. I helped her wash and dressed her up as she wanted to play with you and I".
    Spouse & I with our friendly couple delighted of their bonding.

    Thanks and regards.

    God is joyous with bonding siblings.
     
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  7. sokanasanah

    sokanasanah IL Hall of Fame

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    Heat exchangers? Entropy? Coupled fluid dynamics? Millennial Problems? Whoah! I must say this is the nerdiest post I have ever seen on IL. You should indulge this side of yourself more often. Then perhaps your husband will be able to solve Navier-Stokes for his cardiac haemodynamics issues! Really, how could he not?
    :beer-toast1:
     
  8. Viswamitra

    Viswamitra IL Hall of Fame

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    @Sweety2016,

    That linear thinking of human you are talking about is perhaps because the neurons in our brain are sequential processors and not parallel processors. Even when we multi-task, only one action is focused and another is on auto pilot?
     
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  9. Gauri03

    Gauri03 Moderator Staff Member IL Hall of Fame

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    Good to have you back @mangaii. Hope the break was a productive one!
     
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  10. kaniths

    kaniths IL Hall of Fame

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    Numerous attributes may shape the natural world. We figure and filter out key variables from that generous catalog and develop designs pertaining to our specific goals. With the limited linear approach too we have quite successfully been able to simplify complex behaviors, patterns in most scenarios, and create breakthrough solutions. Couldn't agree more. In that regard, it's only super impressive to note that despite the shortcomings we have managed to make sense of the real world, deciphering everything out there (as much we can) into meaningful insights and designs. Good job then after all! :wink1:

    Some useful thoughts there, thank you for sharing. :beer-toast1:
     
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