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Changing Times And Scriptures

Discussion in 'Snippets of Life (Non-Fiction)' started by HariLakhera, Sep 23, 2017.

  1. Iravati

    Iravati Platinum IL'ite

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    Technically, scriptures have undergone amendments and revisions. I don't know about Gita but the Gospels of the Western Bible have had alterations in the New Testament and the liturgy. Since we know very little about the "original" author of the Testaments, we don't have the first edition. But the Dead Sea Scrolls are now considered to be the earliest known scriptural work outlining the Biblical philosophy. When those scrolls were rediscovered and studied, Biblical scholars found considerable differences between the ancient and modern Bible text. There was also a period of normalization to adjust the discrepancies in Gospels. You might also be interested in skimming Misquoting Jesus. Mind you, the book has detractors and counterarguments. You might want to read them as well. Then there is Athanasian Creed, Arian Creed, Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed, and that Filioque Controversy which spilt the Church into Eastern and Western doctrines.

    That Filioque schism is historic because it partially answers your query. Why has scripture remained sclerotic? It hasn't. When observers of a faith decide that scriptures need amendments, rather than arguing for amendment in the original work, religion is split into a new sect and the reworked/reworded scripture is part of the new religious sect. This is easier than challenging the original work. A nation cannot have two constitutions but it can have multiple religious creeds. I am sure even in Hinduism we must have variants of religious texts though my knowledge on Hindu texts is patchy. In the West, the Greek->Latin->English translations have also unwittingly introduced diverging texts.

    These moral directives are still interpretable, but, has there been any change in practical directives, i.e, tenets which affect our practical aspects of living. Yes, why not. With changing times, needs and landscapes, every one should adapt even the religious precepts and their taxonomy of animals.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2017
  2. HariLakhera

    HariLakhera Platinum IL'ite

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    I do not know much about Bible but have been told that there are three or four versions of Bible. There is only one version of Gita. It's part of great Epic Mahabharata dictated by Sage Vyasa and written by Lord Ganesha. Gita has been translated into almost every language. It has also been interpretated differently.
    I am happy that I have a supporter now who also thinks that with changing times the scriptures can and should also be changed.
    While the basic values of all religions remain the same, there are differences in practice. However, on one issue they are all united- not treating women fairly. I wanted to draw the attention to this point but somehow it seems to have got unnoticed.
    IL being a ladies group, I thought the members will pull their sleeves up and say -United we stand.
     
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  3. Naari

    Naari Platinum IL'ite

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    Hariji, why do you say that women were not treated fairly in scriptures or they preach so?
     
  4. Viswamitra

    Viswamitra IL Hall of Fame

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    Dear HariLakera,

    I have no knowledge about the number of versions of Bible. I am not very knowledgeable about the content of Bhagavad Gita either. In my humble view, Upanishads, Brahma Sutras and Bhagavad Gita are called Prasthana Traya. Upanishads - 108 known - 12 Principal/Main are observations of the Saints hearing to the whisper much later documented in written form. Brahma Sutras - 4 Chapters - 555 Aphoristic Verses are principles written about right living. Bhagavad Gita is the teachings provided by Avatar to His friend/disciple. Upanishads, Brahma Sutras and Bhagavad Gita are respectively known as observations, modelling and application respectively.

    For lack of better terms, they could be considered as architecture, design documents and application software. In my humble view, Bhagavad Gita is already an application software based on the architecture and design documents and subject to interpretation and to be applied based on real life experience as deemed by each learner.

    Viswa
     
  5. jayasala42

    jayasala42 IL Hall of Fame

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    I think though the names of scriptures are very popular, the contents are not fully read by 90% of the population.This applies to scriptures of all the religions. There may not be any difference in the attitude of people even if modifications are made in scriptures because scriptures would never be read fully at any part of time.Occasionally part of scriptures are read thoroughly and interpreted according to need of the hour.There are many more pragmatic things to do for the development of the society in which only the basic principles of scriptures may be of real use.
    Our laws and regulations and codes have been made only taking into account the basics of scriptures.
    While there is no urgency about modification of scriptures as such, if any real modification has to be made in administrative and judicial matters in the real interest of the nation,there is absolutely nothing wrong in modifying the scriptures if the existing ones are found to stand against the welfare of the society.After all scriptures mirror the happenings of the prevalent society .But for the Universal truths that apply universally to all periods of time, other factors may be changed, if deemed fit after discussions among scholars in many fields after due deliberations.

    Jayasala42
     
  6. Iravati

    Iravati Platinum IL'ite

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    I am not familiar with the teachings in Gita. May be, one of these days, I might study it as Indian scriptures are alien to me. The only reason I know a smattering of Biblical history is because of BBC talk shows.

    Snippets is a quieter forum. If you intend to conduct a poll or engage larger audience, the odds of receptive audience is more in 'General Discussions'.
     
  7. Naari

    Naari Platinum IL'ite

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    Assuming we were convinced with the idea of modifying the scriptures, next question is who has the power to do so? For laws & Constitution, there is a specified majority required in the House to be enable to modify or pass Bill of Amendments and only law makers could do that.. What about here? Should the temple priests and scholars be bestowed with that power? What majority would be required here? What would be the process? Can we reconcile the egos of the priests involved?

    I don't even see the idea getting past the initial obstacles of who should do it, forget actually doing it. I think we are toying with too many hypothethicals here.
     
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  8. sindmani

    sindmani Platinum IL'ite

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    My humble opinion is Bagavath geetha itself is an ocean of knowledge which contains many management lessons. Coming to the position of women depicted in scriptures, in few cases women are depicted as person with less strength compared to men but when we see in a broader aspect there are great women stories in ancient puranas. Women are told as great doctors, great orators , great queens and great ministers honoured by all. Early Vedic period was a very good period for women because position of women was very high. She was the head of the family. Hope history repeats and we women have good reputation and position in family and society.
     
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  9. HariLakhera

    HariLakhera Platinum IL'ite

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    Dear Naari,

    Here are some examples:

    Ramcharitmanas -

    1. Bal Kand - " Sati concluded that the Omniscient Lord had come to know of every thing and felt sorry that she lied to Shambhu. The women are silly and stupid by nature"

    2. Aranya Kand - And here is how Sabari describes herself while showing her gratitude to Lord Rama:
    “Adham se adham adham ati nari, tinha mah main mati mand adhari...".

    (Roughly Meaning -as it is, woman is the lowest of lowest of creation and on top of that I am stupid and rudderless)

    3. Lanka Kand - Ravana to his wife Mandodari.
    “Avgun aath sada Ur rahain, asahas, anrit, chapalta, maya, bhaya, avivek, asauch, adaya”--
    (Roughly meaning- A woman has eight vices namely: 1. Indiscrete. 2. Liar 3. Freckle 4. Deceit. 5. Coward. 6. Foolish. 7. Impure. 8.

    4. Ravana- describing women-

    "Dhol, ganwar, Sudra, pashu, aur naari : ye sab tadan ke adhikari"
    (Roughly meaning - drums, sudras, stupids, animals and women - all deserve beating)

    Gita - 9.32

    “For taking refuge in me, they also who, O Arjuna, may be of a sinful birth –woman, vaishayas (prostitutes) as well as sudras(low caste) attain the Supreme Goal” thus comparing amen with prostitutes.

    I think you know about the triple Talak issue in Muslim religion and the fight for empowerment by Christian women in particular and all women in general.

    This is the reason I say women have not been treated fairly by religions.
     
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  10. HariLakhera

    HariLakhera Platinum IL'ite

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    Dear Shri Viswamitra,
    Gita is considered as the gist of all Vedas and Upnishads. My knowledge about Vedas and Upnishads is zero. What ever I know is through Gita which I read. I am still a learner. The common masses, like me, do not understand the deeper meaning when women is compared with lower caste people and prostitutes or when it is said that when women are corrupted, the whole lineage gets corrupted.
     

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